Feb 22, 2007

'Do you support terrorism?'

An American guy commented on the post before previous one. Because of the importance of several points he raised so I'm replying him in an independent post .

If you are
interested you can read his comments here and       here



My perspective of the world :


I don't think that my perspective of the world is not rational. The world today is worse than many previous parts of the history. Just turn on your TV and watch, daily killings every where, daily injuring, daily demolishing, daily tree cutting, daily stealing money, many breaking of humanical and international law, many bias against the weak towards the powerful …and so on. The world isn't becoming safer or more peaceful. I think that every rational man approves on this fact and you too .


The thing which we may not approve on is who is responsible for that, right ?!!


As for me, I think that the reason is only one, I think that the reason is that Islamic teachings of love, peace, mercy, justice, neutralism, equity, cooperation, respecting other cultures ..etc don't exist. Just search in our world about these values and you will find out that non of them are prevailing .



Palestine :

We can't judge if Palestinians can rule themselves or not. The simple reason has been told by your Bush, didn't he beg your Congress to give his new plan in Iraq a chance to see if it works or not?!! So, we must give Hamas the chance to see if they will be able to rule or not. They didn't give them the chance to see if they are able or not, just when they succeed in the democratic elections they directly boycott them, and pressed on them and till now they are under pressure.   I wonder where is this democracy which Amreeica always shout by?!!  Wasn't Hamas the choice of Palestinian people?!!


I think that the rational solution of Palestinian-Zionistic conflict is to follow International law, I think that we approve on that, right?!!



Mohamed, you are my enemy !!


Is that because I oppose with your point of view ?!!


Please be sure that I don't consider you the enemy. I don't consider those who don't share me the same point of view as the enemy. This is the freedom of thinking, you can have your own point of view, I can have my opposed point of view, but we still friends, or at least not enemies. That's what my Islamic religion teaches me .


Those who I consider the enemy is those who kill my brothers, those who don't seek peace but only want surrender, those who steal an inch of our lands, those who refuse real peace. And that's our right to defend ourselves, or what ?!!



My profile :


I appreciate that you're proud to be an American, and me too, I'm proud to belong to Egypt, the land of the great civilization, the land of history, the land which became the tomb of invaders, the state which fired French and English colonists away, the land which helped other states to obtain their independence. I'm proud of being a descendent of the great Egyptian people .


But above all I'm proud of being Muslim, a follower of Islamic religion. That isn't without a reason, but, that's because Islam guides me to the love of my God, it guides me to love my state, it guides me to love other Muslims, it guides me to love other people who don't follow my religion whenever they don't hurt me, it guides me to be loyal to my state, it leads me to the best way of life.


You said that your loyalty as an American is to the institution of your government, that's good, but imagine that an American meet an African, what gathers them?!!    No thing. The first person has a government and the other have a completely different government, in addition, the first feels that his government and state is better than the government and state of the other, so how will he look at him?!! Let me assume; 'What an uncivilized African who belongs to a rudimental state!!'  The first will become arrogant. When you consider governments as the primary loyalty, there became 1 st, 2nd , 3rd states, by another word; the world becomes degrees, there will be up and down, and notice your way of speech and how it's arrogant.


But if an American Muslim meet another Muslim from Central African Republic, if an English Muslim meet a Chilean Muslim, if a Malaysian Muslim meet a Tunisia Muslim, what gathers them?!!!   Islamic religion gathers them. No one surpasses the other, all are equal, whether you're white, red or black you're only Muslim, whether you're from a developing or a developed state you're only Muslim, whether you're rich or poor you're only Muslim. The Prophet set this rule so clearly; "An Arab does not rank higher than a non-Arab, neither does a white (man) than a black (man) except through piety."


So, I ask you, if everyone became loyal to his government institutions and primary to his state, will this invite to equity among people, or will create ranking among peoples?!!

Islamic principles invites to equity among all peoples. Just read Qur'an saying what means; "O mankind! Lo! We have created you male and female , and have made you nations and tribes that ye may know one another. Lo! the noblest of you, in the sight of Allah, is the best in conduct." 49:13   and ask, is that better or various nationalists?!!


Just look at Muslims during the pray, and see how a black Muslim stands beside the white Muslim, how the rich Muslim stands beside the poor Muslim, how a Muslim from a developed country stands beside a Muslim from a developing country!!


So, we don't consider ourselves Iraqis ,Canadians, Brazilians, Egyptians, Russians, Americans first. We are Muslims first.


I think that you know now why I'm Muslim before being Egyptian.



Do you support terrorism?!!!:

Actually, I have to say; What a question?!!

This question has many sides; firstly we must approve on one concept of terrorism, secondly we must know that no one says about himself a terrorist, and finally to see if I support terrorism or not.


Concept of terrorism:

Can't you see that till this moment there is no approved meaning of the word 'Terrorism'?!! Even Americans who hold the task of fighting against terrorism didn't gave us the concept of terrorism which they are fighting against.

Any way, my concept of terrorism is; using force against innocents and civilians to achieve un-noble goals. Killing, rapping, demolishing civilian targets are all images of terrorism. But same acts made in a war battle against soldiers is a different thing.

So, I consider that 9-11 attacks were terrorism committed against innocents, killing innocent children in Palestine is terrorism, demolishing civilian homes in Lebanon was terrorism, Holocaust (if it was real) is terrorism, ..etc.


On the other hand; there is a difference between terrorism and resistance. Those who fight against terrorists are resistants, those who fight against invaders are resistants, those who defend themselves are resistants, those who defend their lands are resistants, those who defend weak people are resistants, those who defend the truth against liars are resistants, those who help resistants are resistants.   So, neither Hezbollah nor Hamas are terrorists, they both are resistance groups, they refuse the fact that Zionists are killing children and that they stole their land, so they are defending themselves and defending their lands.


I'm a terrorist!!:

Don't dream that a one would say about him like that, even if all rational people approved that he is a terrorist who kill innocents and use force to achieve his un-noble goals, he won't say; I'm a terrorist, he will find some justification for killing innocents, and stealing lands of others. E.g. in Crusade wars; did European Christians call themselves killers?!! Sure not, they claimed that this is God's will, and that their message is mercy and peace, however their real goal was stealing the lands of Muslims.   Another example; when Zionists chose Palestinian lands to be their national homeland, they created justifications in Torah, and begged others to help them to unit on one land and made them as their underlings, they asked for the help of English government and they helped them to declare their state on Palestinian state, and now America became its honest underling which give it all needed money and weapons support, they killed and steal the land but they didn't call themselves terrorists.

So, I think that you'd better ask the question like; Do you support killing innocents in Palestine or 9-11?


Supporting terrorism:

Now, if we approve that terrorism includes killing innocents and civilians and using force to achieve un-noble goals, and that there is a difference between terrorism and resistance, so I can answer your question;  No I don't support terrorism.  That's so simply because I'm Muslim, a follower of Islam, Allah is my God, Muhammad is my prophet, Qur'an is my holy book, and Allah tells me about the value of human's spirit in Qur'an ; "On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people : and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. …" 5:32


But if you're talking about resistance against invaders and killing innocents so I completely support it, and all rational thinkers support it. Resistance seeks real peace, resistance seeks real freedom and every one supports that.


The Loop Garoo Kid said...


I will respond briefly first and in depth later.

First, as a matter of form, the quotes in your post are impossible to read until I click on "Show Original Post" by leaving a comment. I therefore suggest you change the contrasting colors as the green against the background you have chosen is impossible to read.

Secondly, I suggest you reread your history--the history of your nation and the history of the Middle East as you seem to have a selective perspective. Although Eqypt is an ancient country, it has been invaded a number of times, by Arabs in the 7th century to name one, and it has bee independent and self governing, most recently, only since 1956. Please remember that but for the Brits and the Americans, today, your street signs might well be printed in German.

I did admire Anwar Sadat.

Again, you seem to be anti Zionist and you fail to recognize the history of the Jewish people and their claim on a Palestinian homeland.

Once you take the position, as I believe you have, that Israel has no right to exist, then you are able to justify anything Hamas or Hezbollah does.

Please understand that I did not support the way that Israel resonded to the kidnapping of its soldiers by Hezbollah.

But I repeat again: If you Start with the proposition that 'Israel is here to stay," how do we live together? then peace is possible.

If you start with the proposition that "Israel has no right to exist and must be destroyed" then like Hamas and Hezbollah, you have condemned yourself and your people to a war and self destruction.

So Mohamed, what is your podition?

Meanwhile, I suggest you read an Article by Lt. Col Craig T. Trebilcock called "The Modern Seven Pillars of Iraq" which articulates better than I did why democracy will not work in Iraq and why our (U.S.) policy is misguided.

Just Google "Trebilcock Seven Pillars Iraq" and you will find the article in the February edition of Army Magazine.

More later.

Mohamed said...

Ok Mr.Kid

I'll wait for the more to reply, but just some things..

That looks like that you aim at a discussion, and one of the most things which I don't like is that to chat with mirage!! You undersand?!!

If you have an account on Blogger, Please comment using it.

Also, I don't understand your nick name, What it means?!!

I estimate that you are 60:75 years old, so what is the intersting thing to chat with quarter of your age?!!! Don't take it offensive, but just I find this odd something, and I'm intersting to know the reason. Is that to 'enlighten' me?!! ;)

Waiting for your deep respond,

The Loop Garoo Kid said...

Mohamed, Mohamed,

In reply to your last comment, let me respond.

You do not like chatting with a mirage? Such is the nature of blogging and cyberspace where anonymity and the assumption of identity has its uses. I do not wish to enter into a metaphysical discussion on the nature of identity. I will merely advise that what I state is more important than my individual identity and I have given you enough information about myself for you to respond to my comments.

I am not nearly as old as you believe. I have children about your age which may account for willingness to engage you in discussion.

You did state at one point that you are studying law. I have no idea how law is studied at your school, assuming you attend one as it is possible to study law outside of one, however in our country the study of law involves the Socratic method--the answering of questions. I therefore only request that you answer the questions I ask which you have heretofore largely avoided.

I have other responsibiliies which preclude me from having my own blog so I navigate amongst a few and visit yours from time to time.

As for my nickname, its provenance is readily available if you care to look.

Let us examine a few of your comments.

Terrorism is more easily defined than you believe. I consider the American Heritage Dictionary authoritative for American English.
It defines terrorism as: 1. The use of terror, violence, and intimidation to achieve an end; 2. Fear and subjugation produced by this; 3. A system of government that uses terror to rule.

Before we move on the Hamas, you must answer the following question and defend your answer: Do you believe that the nation of Israel has a right to exist?

Once you answer this question, the rest of your comments are easily explained together with the flaws in your logic.

From your comments, I believe you will answer "No."

But let us move on to Hamas, which you correctly state was democratically elected. You believe Hamas should be given a chance to govern in Gaza. Hamas is being given its chance and look at the result.

As you are aware: Hamas does not recognize Israel's right to exist and inflicts violence on Israeli citizens. As you are also aware, the Palestinian state is given vast sums of money by Israel and the European Union without which it cannot function.

Israel and the EU believe in Israel's right to exist and have cut off funding which has causes hardship for everyday Palestinians. Before the election of Hamas to the Palestinian parliment, the EU gave the PA $500 million US annually.

The funding will be reinstated if Hamas adheres to the Three Principles outlined by the international community: Hamas must renounce violence; it must recognize Israel's right to exist; and it must express clear support for the Middle East peace process as outlined by the 1993 Oslo Accords.

I think that the every day lives of Palestinians would improve if Hamas would agree to the Three Principles, do you agree?

Your description of Hamas and Hezbollah as "resistants" is sadly ludricous. "Ludicrous" means laughable. So how can a statement be sadly laughable?

Because it is as internally inconsistant and illogical as most of your agruments. You cite much scripture, most of which I ignore, but then you state: "When Zionists chose Palestinian lands to be their homeland they created justifications in Torah..."

That statement, Mohamed, has many implications which perhaps we will explore at a later time. For now, if you are brave enough, I expect an answer to the following question: "Does the nation of Israel have a right to exist."
Defend your answer.

Mohamed said...

Yes, I'm brave enough to reply :)

Actually, I can't reply these days because of my study, and also I have some other things to do through e-mail. But I promise to reply as soon as I can, may be within a week.

I know that chatting without knowing much about the other side is ordinary on blogs, but I just think that you need a long discussion so I prefer to know the mind and way of thinking of my guest.
Any way, I'll respect your will so forget it!!

And don't worry, I'll defend well my point of view ;)

Till we meet again,

Egyptian Kangaroo said...

Is this what they call Islam ?

Al Qaeda scores against "infidel" Westerners? Some of these tourists were Muslims who were on their way to perform Omra! What can al Qaeda ever hope to gain by reviving these senseless attacks? Will it topple the Saudi monarchy that has been in power for ever -- and which because of strategic (ie oil) interests will stay that way? No. Will it make foreign companies quit Saudi Arabia? No again. The only thing that it will do is vilify a faith that regards the taking of innocent life as a grave sin and increase the confusion about the true nature of Islam.
please let me know what you think @ http://egyptiankangaroo.blogspot.com/

Mohamed said...

Hi Mr.Kid,

I'm so sorry for all this delay, and sorry again that I won't reply also now, that's not because I'm not intersted in replying you, but in contrary; your points are really important and I really want to discuss them on my blog, but I'm really busy these days. I'll try to reply as sooner as I can.


شباب روش طحن said...

سعيد جدا بالتعرف علي صفحتك وعليك والحقيقة أن العديد من الأشخاص يسعوا لأن يثبتوا شبه الإرهاب علي الدين الإسلامي وذلك ليس إلا لرغبتهم في إظهار الإسلام بصورة معينة للعالم وهي بالطبع غير طيبة ثم يقوموا ببعض الخلط للأوراق وبعض القلب للحقائق ثم يضيفون في النهاية بعض الفهم لأيات القرأن بناءا علي رؤيتهم هم له وليس بناءا علي حقيقته وأصوله ثم يثبتون عليه تهمة الإرهاب ...........ولكنهم في الحقيقة مخطئين

The Loop Garoo KId said...


When you are able to take a break from your studies to answer my question whether you believe Israel has a right to exist, I would like you to address another issue.

Some Muslims in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Israel, strap explosives to their bodies or drive vehicles loaded w/ explosives and blow themselves up. These people are called suicide bombers. Sometimes their targets are military personnel but often their targets are civilians.

Having read your postings, I am quite certain that you deplore this practice. My question is: Why do some Muslims become suicide bombers?

I am a westerner and an American. The concept of strapping explosives to my body and blowing myself up is so foreign to me, culturally and religiously, it is impossible for me to understand a suicide bomber's motivation.

I look foward to your comments on this issue, although if you were to respond, "I have no idea why some of my co-religionists act this way," I will understand completely.

Anonymous said...

Loop Garoo,

(what does that mean, anyway? -- I am old and out of the loop, meaning me). I am a western lady, and I just finished reading a book called "Secrets of the Koran--Revealing Insights into Islam's Holy Book" by Don Richardson. It answers many questions I had about Islam, but then it ends by proselityzing Evangelical Christianity, which is as immutable as Mohammedanism -- "We must win hearts and minds, and turn them from their errors".

On the subject as to why young Muslim men (and now, horrors, young women) blow themselves up, Mr. Richardson has this to say: "Suicide bombers tend to be either brainwashed youths or not-very-bright adults. The more dangerous radical Muslims are the brainwashers. They may be mullahs teaching in mosques or madrasas, heads of Islamic charitable organizations, writers in Islamic newsletters, embassy personnel or professors subverting our sons and daughters with Islamic propoganda on Western campuses".

So, why are some people so easily brainwashed? It's probably because they have nothing to lose, they are at loose ends, their only instruction comes from the radical side of Islam, the ones who believe in the goal of total Islamic supremacy over the world and distort the teachings of the Qu'ran. Theirs is an agenda of power, and control at any cost. They promise a heaven of 72 virgins (perpetual ones at that), but they probably wouldn't strap explosives to themselves. They view those that are willing to do their bidding in the name of Islam as totally expendable.

Remember the cold war with Russia and China? I remember a cartoon showing Mao working out the logistics and anticipated Chinese losses of an atomic war with the western democracies: "Let's see--200 million killed, that leaves me---".

I am a confirmed agnostic (thanks to the freedoms guaranteed us by our Constitution), but I pray that this radical Islamic ideology can be held at bay somehow. This Iraq involvement is a huge "oops" and did more to unleash more radicalism. We can always take down a dictator; we need to eradicate Al Queda, if we can just find them. We know that only in America and other Western nations is life held dear, and not so cheaply as in communist or radical Islamic states,etc. So far the ideologies are evenly matched, no? How many souls are alive on this planet? Islam represents only a fraction of those souls, but it is growing due to the disenfranchisement of some folks who see no other alternative. What can we do to keep the balance?

I don't fear that our Mohamed will ever strap explosives to himself; he does not consider that Jihad. Perhaps someday he will have to pick up a rifle and defend his country, although he says he is a Muslim first and Egyptian second. He could never be a terrorist, but he is a proselityzer, yes? (Forgive my mis-spellings).

Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA---

The Loop Garoo Kid said...


Tick tock.



How can the trading of insults have

Mohamed, why do you call your fellow adversary a mirage? He is
reaching for "Meeting Of The Minds"
and it's a discussion.

Should we attempt to talk to the young? Yes! Yes! The Old, Tired
Leaders have failed humanity. Do not discourage discussion! May both sides gain from the exchange!



Anonymous said...

It has been asked...What Is A Terrorist?

When the wolf dons sheeps clothing!

When a human being cuts off a head
or the right hand!

When a teacher takes a baby student
and teaches hate!

When a bomb-master tells the village idiot that he gets virgins
to play sex with if he blows himself up!

When a father or mother cuts their
young girl's throat, and calls it

When and educated person justifies
these crimes!

When pious-posturing "holy men" defend these grim acts in the name of a Creator!

He that hath an ear, let him hear.

Mohamed said...

Snake Hunters,

Why you commented twice as Anonymous?!!!!

Don't be afraid... Express your opinion so freely... Don't hide under 'other names'...

I welcome any comment whenever they are presented by the good way.


Mohamed, May 12, 2007
You are familar with Sharia...

a) Please explain "Defensive Jihad"

b) Then Explain "Offensive Jihad"

This would be of great benefit to all. I will not interrupt again, if you wish. reb


Mohamed said...

Mr red,

I appreciate your will to discuss some points with me as a Muslim, but I'm really busy these days because of my exams, I'll start in 22 of this month and finish in 18th of the next month, and by raising every day a new point to be discussed it may be hard to discuss all of them.

Please let me know that you read this message,

Welcome any time on my blog,



Message received, 05/15/07 REB